Discipline requires a doer; an action creating karma. Karma must return to the doer. The enlighten one has dropped the ego thereby stepping outside the influence of action. To create karma to lose it doesn’t make sense.
Action-less action happens through seeing; observation. Inner vision is the deepest aspect of the human being. Seeing requires no action simply open the eyes and vision is there.
My position is the evolution of human kind has advance beyond days of old worn out techniques that require a life time to awaken to what we are not.
Myth Buster, Thank you for answering. Karma does not interpellate good or bad. Karma is the repercussion of all action.
David, I have not misunderstood anything concerning karma. The Soka Gakkai Dictionary of Buddhism has been in my collection for some time now. Thank you anyway, I am sure it will be helpful for others also.
I wonder if you have understood my question and commentary. Advancements in the realization of the laws of karma include knowledge of our ability to step out of the influence of karma altogether. No self…no karma.
Rev not a real Rev, Thank you for the URL. That one is not in my collection. The next to the last paragraph says it all.
XK1, I was not asking for an argument or a logical answer. Neither belongs in spiritual questions. When it comes to a spiritual realization of no-self regarding enlightenment and answers faith or belief does not belong either. Avoiding the exchange of words due to semantics is like wearing a mask.
Muthus S, Through your words I see you are confused… Certainly you are confused also with who is saying these things in your answer. However, the recognition of being in a mortal body with senses is not a problem. I have come to the realization I am much more than the physical in the ever changing impairment relative field of Being. I hold no thought of being a child of God in need of salvation or identify with a self. I see Godliness in everything but no God. I will go as far to say only Source is and we all are one with that. Karma is a law of the universe. (Law meaning rule of procedure)
In the School of Life I hope one day you will wake up and graduate from preschool. Stop living in fear and end your suffering by looking within for the kingdom of heaven.
selfless and noble action does not create any bad karma only selfish action does. If you are mindful of your thoughts, words and actions you can then become karma free as there will no negativity attached to them. This discipline can then lead to enlightenment. It can happen in one lifetime or take many lifetimes depending on your level of discipline.
It seems that you have a misunderstanding of Karma. Here is a detailed definition, if you are interseted.
[æ¥] (Skt; Pali kamma; Jpn go )
Potentials in the inner, uncon-scious realm of life created through one’s actions in the past or present that manifest themselves as various results in the present or future. Karma is a variation of the Sanskrit karman, which means act, action, a former act leading to a future result, or result. Buddhism interprets karma in two ways: as indicating three categories of action, i.e., mental, verbal, and physical, and as indicating a dormant force thereby produced. That is, one’s thought, speech, and behavior, both good and bad, imprint themselves as a latent force or potential in one’s life.This latent force, or karma, when activated by an external stimulus, produces a corresponding good or bad effect, i.e., happiness or suffering. There are also neutral acts that produce neither good nor bad results. According to this concept of karma, one’s actions in the past have shaped one’s present reality, and one’s actions in the present will in turn influ-ence one’s future. This law of karmic causality operates in perpetuity, car-rying over from one lifetime to the next and remaining with one in the latent state between death and rebirth.It is karma, therefore, that accounts for the circumstances of one’s birth, one’s individual nature, and in general the differences among all living beings and their environments. It was traditionally viewed as a natural process in which no god or deity could intervene. The Hindu gods, in fact, were subject to the same law of karma as people, having become gods supposedly through the creation of good karma. The idea of karma predates Buddhism and was already prevalent in Indian society well before the time of Shakyamuni. This pre-Buddhist view of karma, however, had an element of determinism, serving more to explain one’s lot in life and compel one to accept it than inspiring hope for change or transforma-tion. The Brahmans, who were at the top of the Indian class structure by birth, may well have emphasized this view to secure their own role. The idea of karma was further developed, however, in the Buddhist teachings.Shakyamuni maintained that what makes a person noble or humble is not birth but one’s actions. Therefore the Buddhist doctrine of karma is not fatalistic. Rather, karma is viewed not only as a means to explain the present, but also as the potential force through which to influence one’s future. Mahayana Buddhism holds that the sum of actions and experiences of the present and previous lifetimes are accumulated and stored as karma in the depths of life and will form the framework of in-dividual existence in the next lifetime. Buddhism therefore encourages people to create the best possible karma in the present in order to ensure the best possible outcome in the future. In terms of time, some types of karma produce effects in the present lifetime, others in the next lifetime, and still others in subsequent lifetimes. This depends on the nature, intensity, and repetitiveness of the acts that caused them. Only those types of karma that are extremely good or bad will last into future existences. The other, more minor, types will produce results in this lifetime. Those that are neither good nor bad will bring about no results.Karma is broadly divided into two types: fixed and unfixed. Fixed karma is said to produce a fixed result–that is, for any given fixed karma there is a specific effect that will become manifest at a specific time. In the case of unfixed karma, any of various results or general outcomes might arise at an indeterminate time. Irrespective of these differences, the Buddhist philosophy of karma, particularly that of Mahayana Buddhism, is not fatalistic. No ill effect is so fixed or predetermined that good karma from Buddhist practice in the present cannot transform it for the better. Moreover, any type of karma needs interaction with the corresponding conditions to become manifest. See also fixed karma; unfixed karma.
also see eightfold path in Buddhist Dictionary.
I started to argue your logic but it was obvious I would be caught up in semantics. Rather I will just stick to your question “How can spiritual discipline lead to enlightenment?”. I suppose having the discipline to see you own true self is how you become enlightened. By that I would say you have to have the ‘faith’ or belief that you are indeed enlightened. Without that faith you cannot recognize who you really are. I will stop here because beyond this is ALL semantics.
Thanks for an enlightening question.