Discussion Forum

Do you think atheists and theists both use faith?

by The Right Path:

(There is a question at the very end)

An atheist professor of philosophy speaks to his class on the problem science has with God, The Almighty.
He asks one of his new students to stand and…..
Prof: So you believe in God?
Student: Absolutely, sir.
Prof : Is God good?
Student: Sure.
Prof: Is God all-powerful?
Student: Yes.
Prof: My brother died of cancer even though he prayed to God to heal him.
Most of us would attempt to help others who are ill. But God didn’t. How is this God good then? Hmm?
(Student is silent.)
Prof: You can’t answer, can you? Let’s start again, young fella. Is God good?
Student: Yes.
Prof: Is Satan good?
Student : No.
Prof: Where does Satan come from?
Student:From…God…
Prof: That’s right. Tell me son, is there evil in this world?
Student:Yes.
Prof: Evil is everywhere, isn’t it? And God did make everything. Correct?
Student: Yes.
Prof: So who created evil?
(Student does not answer.)
Prof: Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible things exist in the world, don’t they?
Student: Yes, sir.
Prof: So, who created them?
(Student has no answer.)
Prof: Science says you have 5 senses you use to identify and observe the world around you.
Tell me, son…Have you ever seen God?
Student: No, sir.
Prof: Tell us if you have ever heard your God?
Student:No, sir.
Prof: Have you ever felt your God, tasted your God, smelt your God? Have you ever had any sensory perception of God for that matter?
Student: No, sir. I’m afraid I haven’t.
Prof: Yet you still believe in Him?
Student: Yes.
Prof: According to empirical, testable, demonstrable protocol, science says your GOD doesn’t exist.
What do you say to that, son?
Student: Nothing. I only have my faith.
Prof: Yes. Faith. And that is the problem science has.
Student: Professor, is there such a thing as heat?
Prof: Yes.
Student: And is there such a thing as cold?
Prof: Yes.
Student: No sir. There isn’t.
(The lecture theatre becomes very quiet with this turn of events.)
Student : Sir, you can have lots of heat, even more heat, superheat, mega heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat. But we don’t have anything called cold. We can hit 458 degrees below zero which is no heat, but we can’t go any further after that.
There is no such thing as cold . Cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat
We cannot measure cold. Heat is energy . Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the absence of it .
(There is pin-drop silence in the lecture theatre.)
Student: What about darkness, Professor? Is there such a thing as darkness?
Prof: Yes. What is night if there isn’t darkness?
Student : You’re wrong again, sir. Darkness is the absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright light, flashing light….But if you have no light constantly, you have nothing and it’s called darkness, isn’t it? In reality, darkness isn’t. If it were you would be able to make darkness darker, wouldn’t you?
Prof: So what is the point you are making, young man?
Student: Sir, my point is your philosophical premise is flawed.
Prof: Flawed? Can you explain how?
Student: Sir, you are working on the premise of duality. You argue there is life and then there is death, a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something finite, something we can measure. Sir, science can’t even explain a thought. It uses electricity and magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one.To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life: just the absence of it.
Now tell me, Professor.Do you teach your students that they evolved from a monkey?
Prof: If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, yes, of course, I do.
Student: Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?
(The Professor shakes his head with a smile, beginning to realize where the argument is going.)
Student: Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavor, are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you not a scientist but a preacher? (The class starts to laugh at the Professor.)
Student: Is there anyone in the class who has ever seen the Professor’s brain?
(The class breaks out into more laughter.)
Student : Is there anyone here who has ever heard the Professor’s brain, felt it, touched or smelt it? No one appears to have done so. So, according to the established rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science says that you have no brain,sir.
With all due respect, sir, how do we then trust your lectures, sir?
(The room is silent. The professor stares at the student, his face unfathomable.)
Prof: I guess you’ll have to take them on faith, son.
Student: That is it sir… The link between man & god is FAITH. That is all that keeps things moving & alive.

At the end of the day,
Doesn’t this show that both atheists and theists use faith?

Answer by The Reverend Soleil
Uhhh…no.

We can and do directly witness evolution –both within human timeframes through mutations in bacteria, and on the geological level through the fossil record.

Just because you deliberately keep yourself ignorant of the research, that doesn’t make it go away for the rest of us.

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Frou Frou
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Frou Frou

…skip to the end…

…no is the answer

skeptik
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skeptik

Not even close.

What this shows is that many religious believers have no problem whatsoever bearing false witness in support of their cause.

And that many others are pathologically incapable of distinguishing fact from fiction.

Purple Monkey Dishwaher
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Purple Monkey Dishwaher

i have seen this one before. The professor did a terrible job in backing up his statement. he could have pointed out that there are numerous times where you can see evolution happen, especially in bacteria. dark can be seen and understood, Cold can be felt and understood, God can not. we have plenty of medical equipment to show we have brains not to mention all the times we have cut into the human head and prove we have a brain. the student attempts to make good points, but the professor does nothing to help his own cause, which as… Read more »

jeffrcal
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jeffrcal

No it doesn’t. In this context I would use faith to mean belief without evidence. In that context atheism doesn’t rely on faith at all. Where there is not evidence there is no belief. As far as this cute story (which I’ve seen before by the way) the student should be encouraged to be skeptical of the professor’s claims and research for himself. However, let’s be honest, the evidence for the existence of the professor’s brain is far better than the evidence for God. This argument is called a “straw man” argument. You seem to be equating atheist and scientist… Read more »

ninjacrumb
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ninjacrumb

First, I would be surprised if anyone bothered to read the whole question.

Second, it`s not too convincing making up dialogue between two imaginary people to prove your point.

Third, your imaginary Prof. is a retard and should lose his tenure ship if he teaches that humans evolved from monkeys.

Fourth, since your Prof. is a retard that means it is actually YOU who is the retard since you created him and put your words into his imaginary mouth.

big dawgs lady
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big dawgs lady

Wow, I love it!! God Bless you for that. It sure proves it to me. Let us see know what kind of answers this question generates.

sjp
Guest
sjp

well theists use faith
and I am an atheist and i do not use faith, it think it is stupid, I use logic

Flick
Guest
Flick

That would be a no!

I can’t believe you wasted time typing out that complete load of rubbish.

I suggest you do a little more research, cringe at your own stupidity and come back and apologise.

meissen97
Guest
meissen97

Faith, the belief in something without evidence.

Evolution has evidence. No faith required.

Of course I should point out that this is also blatantly wrong since no one, except ignorant Creationists like yourself, believes we came from monkeys.

Edit: Oh, and I must point out that the student did not in any way dissuade the arguments the professor put forth. So the claims are still valid. The student also tried arguing with and about nothing more than a label. Cold and dark are labels.

jrrose
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jrrose

Let me give you a few examples as to what ‘faith’ is. -religion: a strong belief in a supernatural power or powers that control human destiny; “he lost his faith but not his morality” -complete confidence in a person or plan etc; “he cherished the faith of a good woman”; “the doctor-patient relationship is based on trust” -religion: an institution to express belief in a divine power; “he was raised in the Baptist religion”; “a member of his own faith contradicted him” -loyalty or allegiance to a cause or a person; “keep the faith”; “they broke faith with their investors”… Read more »

Muhammed Asif
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Muhammed Asif

I heard of this particular ”debate” a thousand times. Some say the student was Dr. Zakir Naik.

My personal opinion is that, judging by his answers, that atheist professor is certainly not the brightest.

David Carrington Jr.
Guest
David Carrington Jr.

No, it’s just an unconvincing sophistry.

A Modest Proposal
Guest
A Modest Proposal

No, not really. We actually have medical instruments that allow us to see brains.

I love also how in each of these types of stories the professor for some reason doesn’t know basic thermodynamics or electromagnetism, whatever. All of these stories are reality-challenged and intellectually dishonest on the creator’s end.

Born Free
Guest
Born Free

These strawman creationist stories makes we want to cry for the sake of humanity. This is nothing but a dumb argument.

Science isn’t faith, religion is.

BarkingToad
Guest
BarkingToad

tl;dr
And no.

EDIT: Okay, I actually bothered reading it now.
You are aware that the first part of this is older than any living human, and the second part is simply fallacious, right?

Evolution is an observed fact, we can see it happen. You can go out and observe it yourself.

And the professors brain can be shown empirically to exist. Even without killing him, we can just perform an MRI.

Without evidence, faith is foolish.

God III: SJW LaDouche
Guest
God III: SJW LaDouche

Faith (belief) is an anthropic concept. Theistic faith (theism) is not necessarily.

Question FAIL.

Alex B introspective emo ranger!
Guest
Alex B introspective emo ranger!

TOO LONG….No one actually reads these…No fatih is religion based only…Besides define God, Faith, and Religion

Liberal Asskicker
Guest
Liberal Asskicker

Atheists HAVE faith, but they bury it.