Home Discussion Forum Do you like the irony of denial of pagan origins of Christmas?

Do you like the irony of denial of pagan origins of Christmas?

The ones that say “Christmas is the celebration of Jesus’ birth. There is nothing pagan about that.”
When of course, celebrating birthdays has purely pagan religious origins.

20 COMMENTS

  1. Almost as much as the irony of claiming that “Happy Holidays” and “Xmas” are secular “attacks” on Christmas, when both originate in England in the 16th and 17th centuries, the former a term to include all the holy days of advent, Christmas and New Years, and the later an abbreviation using the Greek letter “Chi” (which looks like a Latin X and is the first letter in Christ’s name).

  2. I’m flattered that you even accept that Christ was born, in that you acknowledge his Birth! The rest………I could care less about…..We do celebrate his birth and that no one will ever take away from the rest of the world no matter how ironical you think that is.

  3. Who cares about pagan origins? They are everywhere.
    Thursay is Thorsday and Friday is for Freya so let’s not get bent out of shape about not having parties.
    Life is a party and there is no reason not to celebrate every day as a Christian with no concern about how pagan it might be
    I love when the liberated atheists want to rein in those wild hedonistic Christians. Next the atheist police will be counting how often I say grace over my Snickers bar.Tut tut tut!

  4. actually, roman catholics made up the word holiday meaning holy day. yet i don’t understand how people ended up getting presents and worshipping a pine tree.

  5. Almost every aspect of social events preexisted what we do today. Voting has pagan origins. Bathing has pagan origins. Art has pagan origins. The earliest cultures were pagan. So what?
    I’m not denying that the things associated with Christmas are pagan — I’m saying it’s irrelevant, because Christmas is the day the early church set aside to celebrate the birth of Jesus. Not just because it was his birthday, but because of what his birth meant to humankind. It doesn’t matter whether that day is 12/25 or 8/15. If celebrating birthdays is pagan in origin, so what? The church developed a calendar of fixed and moveable feasts. The fact that pagan religions also had feast days is irrelevant to the meaning behind the event.
    The tree, mistletoe, etc., are prevalent in western culture, but those symbols aren’t even used in other cultures. So are those Christmas celebrations more valid?
    For argument’s sake, let’s say everything about Christmas is pagan. So what? Again, it just all comes down to celebrating the birth of the Savior of the world. How you choose to do that and how I choose to do that might be very different.
    Why does it matter? Why does that make the event of Christ’s birth any less important?
    The answer is, “It doesn’t.”
    _____________
    Lady Morgana: Christmas is the day that we celebrate his birth. If he was actually born in July, June or September, it doesn’t matter. I have celebrated my birthday on days other than the actual day. I’m betting that at some time in your life, you have, too. Does that mean you stole someone else’s celebration away from them?
    And if you or any pagans wish to celebrate something on 12/25 — feel free. It doesn’t take anything away from my celebration of the Lord’s birth.

  6. It must be difficult, always having to deny the truth while claiming their own falsehoods true. I must admit, I do enjoy the irony of it all.

  7. Indeed I do. Particularly when, after listening to them claim that Christmas is the celebration of Jesus’ birth, I tactfully point out to them that Jesus was born in the summer.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/12/09/astronomers-jesus-was-bor_n_149749.html
    They moved it to December because the pagans were celebrating the Solstice and would not quit celebrating it, so the sneaky christians move their leader’s birthday to coincide with the pagan celebration, with the idea of absorbing it as their own.
    It almost worked, but history will not be denied. TRUE history, that is.

  8. Yes, December 25 was the date of a major pagan festival, but the real question that must be addressed is, What was the church’s intent in choosing THAT date for the celebration of the birth of Christ?
    The early church chose this date to point to the triumph that Christ’s birth represented over the pagan traditions of the Roman empire. In other words, the church was not endorsing a pagan ceremony but establishing a rival celebration.
    Today the world has all but forgotten the pagan gods of Rome. But at least a billion people on planet Earth celebrate the Christ of Christmas.
    I’m not aware of a long pagan tradition of celebrating personal birthdays, early Greeks and Romans celebrated the birthdays of the gods, but not those of men.
    However, as time went on, and some men became powerful political figures, it is understandable that prominent men felt that their own birthdays were as important as those of the gods so they had celebrations on the anniversary of their birth. The Romans kept accurate birth records, therefore they not only knew when people were born, but knew their ages, too. But, as the Roman Empire declined, so did birthday celebrations.
    Birthday celebrations as we know them today came not from paganism but from the church:
    By the twelfth century, the Catholic Church began keeping birth records and , sometimes children were given the name of a patron Saint at baptism. And by the fourteenth century, this idea was considered an official ritual of the Church. This ceremonial custom was called the “name day” and celebration was considered proper, because it was a day sacred to the Saint – the day of his death.
    In the Dark and Middle Ages, superstition suggested that evil spirits wanted the souls of newborn infants and were, therefore, a constant danger. Only baptism was an effective deterrent. For this reason, early baptism was important and baptism on the day of birth was considered the best defense. As the baptism of infants on their day of birth became common, it is easy to understand how celebrating a person’s birthday became so popular and has continued up to the present day.
    If you have information on the birthdays of ordinary citizens being a pagan religious celebration, I would be obliged if you could share that with us and cite your sources.

  9. It actually irritates me. I don’t think some parts of Christianity would annoy me as much if they just admitted that it was pagan.

  10. As a Pagan Reconstructionist, it’s nothing new to me. 🙂 I personally have no problem with anyone celebrating whatever they want, whenever they want. But if someone’s going to get in my face with an attitude saying their deity is the *only* “reason for the season,” they’re going to get a history lesson.
    They may celebrate Christ’s birth on that day, but that is the only part of the holiday that can be called Christian. Everything else came from a multitude of pre-Christian Pagan faiths, and just because something has been “Christianized” and given a new meaning, does not magically make the origins and old meanings disappear. It’s those Christians who think they “own” everything and feel that gives them the right to define and dictate to everyone else that annoy me.

  11. Nothing ironical about it.
    What is ironic is people who profess deep scepticism about the claims of Christianity, but will swallow any neo-pagan nonsense hook, line and sinker.
    A historical fact. December 25th was not a major pagan festival when and where Christmas originated – in Rome. There is no festival in any Roman calendar before the fourth century when Natalis Invicti appeared – at the same time that Christmas appeared in calendars.
    Another historical fact. Christian writers had speculated 100 years earlier that Christ was conceived on March 25th.
    There is nothing in the historical record to show any pagan origin for anything about Christmas (except maybe the word Yule), though I don’t expect someone as gullible as you (as far as pagan myths go) to accept that.

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